Dyes

[retiredcpo]

Just tried the steel dyes for the first time
tired appling it with a small paint brush.
Im sure I did something wrong cause I was not impressed.
Im going to try to sand blast it off and retry
anyone have any pointers
retiredcpo
Ok I am editing this post because I think I used the wrong words I was expectng to have great result the first time
Im not sure i applied things right I am sure it is a great product and I will like it once I figure out what Im doing
Steel seams to be a great guy and even offered a refund which I dont want I am just looking for some pointers one what Im doing from those with experiance I will be trying again Ill let everyone now how it works out
retiredcpo

[steelfx]

Just tried the steel dyes for the first time
tired appling it with a small paint brush.
Im sure I did something wrong cause I was not impressed.
Im going to try to sand blast it off and retry
anyone have any pointers
retiredcpo

Try not to get discouraged or un-impressed with anything new until you've done some trial and error and
practice. Without seeing the condition of your steel prior to applying the dyes, it's hard for me to trooubleshoot, but
my guess is the steel needed to be flap-disked w/ 120 grit to get a pretty high polish. If you like, I could post some
photos of very nice dyed steel, also done with a bristle brush. You don't need to sand-blast it off, just hit it w/
a 120-grit flap disk & give it another go.

thanks,

Bill

[CHD]

I am so glad to see this forum. I have tried two kinds of dyes and stains. They bead up when applied. I have thinned them with thinner and tried strait out of the bottle. We are using cold rolled steel. Ground very well. No slag what so ever. What's the secret? This stuff isn't cheap!

[retiredcpo]

steelfx
sorry if I gave the wrong impression I am not giving up I will try again several times I was just expecting better results the first time The steel was sanded clean prior to using the dye.
I was going to try sand blasting it off because the part has limes in it I made using the marking feature my macine has
If I sand to much they will be gone. I will cut a new part if I have to its small and its all part of the learning process
By all means post some pics the only one I have seen is of a roster.
Retiredcpo

[steelfx]

I am so glad to see this forum. I have tried two kinds of dyes and stains. They bead up when applied. I have thinned them with thinner and tried strait out of the bottle. We are using cold rolled steel. Ground very well. No slag what so ever. What's the secret? This stuff isn't cheap!

Not all dyes and/or stains are compatible with metal. There are many kinds of dyes available, both organic & inorganic.
Some dyes are only suitable for porous surfaces and others work well only on non-porous surfaces like metal.

Wherever you purchase dyes that are intended for artistic use on metal, especially steel...make sure you're buying
solvent dye.

Beading up indicates one of two things. 1) The metal surface is too shiny, almost a chrome or mirror finish. Even a solvent dye will bead up on a surface that's too slick.

2) There is some residual oil, be it fingerprint (skin oil), or oil from a petroleum based cleaner. You never want to use any kind of cleaner or solvent on bare steel prior to patinas or dyes.

Hope that helps.

Bill

[steelfx]

steelfx
sorry if I gave the wrong impression I am not giving up I will try again several times I was just expecting better results the first time The steel was sanded clean prior to using the dye.
I was going to try sand blasting it off because the part has limes in it I made using the marking feature my macine has
If I sand to much they will be gone. I will cut a new part if I have to its small and its all part of the learning process
By all means post some pics the only one I have seen is of a roster.
Retiredcpo

By "sanding", do you mean you used a Random Orbital or DA sander? Using those tools, or even sanding by hand, will not
give the brilliant, shiny substrate that you will get using an angle grinder & a 120-grit flap disk. The cool thing about the dyes is that they are translucent, which accentuates the polished steel. If the steel is the least bit dull, then the dye coloration will also be dull.

Here's a group of items done by Harold B. in NM.

Bill

[CHD]

I will try 120as you stated previously. We are using a low grit now.

[retiredcpo]

Steel
By sanding I mean a angle grinder either air or elcetric(mostly air) with flap discs of grits up to 120
I dont rember for sure but the peice i tried I might have used a Med grit scothc brite pad on as well, And it was several hours between preping the steel to dying.
I am going to try just 120 grit discs and dye imedatly after and see how that goes.
Retiredcpo

[steelfx]

Sounds like a good plan. Please let me know how it goes.

Bill

[retiredcpo]

What should i be looking for when I apply it. I was expecting it to dye fast like paint but was very slow to show up
I had to apply alot of it. the yellow had drak brown streaks on it
After I got done Like I said I was not real impresses so I took some 1000 grit steel wool to it the red looked real dull but the yellow actually improved alot
Retiredcpo

[steelfx]

I sent you a PM. My email is bill@steelf-x.com
Phone number is: 800.710.1273

thanks,

Bill

[retiredcpo]

OK I tried it again properly sanding with 120 grit then dying right after. results where about the same I tried taking a few pics but they did not turn out to well was very streaky and un even. I cant take new pics as I have sanded it off again. I am now getting the impression I am applying it to thick since Im not sure how much to apply at first it seams very watery I keep painting on more then it goes streaky ect. I am appling this to dry steel not sure if ths makes a differance

[steelfx]

Les,

I just put together a basic visual aid for you. In the near future, I will do a short video & you'll see
how remarkably easy it is. The bottom photo, although a tad blurry, looks like a Roloc? sander.
You will not get the proper shine on steel with that type of abrasive, typically a non-woven disc.

Take a look at the attached photo & text & call me in the morning.

Bill

[retiredcpo]

Bill
Im not using a roloc Im using the same make of electric grinder(maybee a differant model hard to tell)
And a 120 grit flap disk while not the norton brand (siat) it looks exactly like the one show in your book
Looking at the pics you just posted I am getting simalar results while hard to see in the welcome sign I can see dark lines in both the green and yellow colors I was getting the same which I was not expecting.
For this project I have going dont want the heavy dark lines(i call them streaks).
So from what I have learned so far from trying things, your books, and you videos, I think the problem is with the way I am appling it. I think for the smooth consistant coloring I am looking for I need to try a airbrush.
My brother will be coming over today and he is very good with a airbrush so Ill be talking to him about it.
Again please understand I am not unhappy with the product Just tring to figure it out, you guys are way more artistic then I am.
Les

[hobbyrobbie]

Les,
I used an air-brush on the rooster that was posted on the forum. I had never used an air-brush before so I was very unsure how the dyes would turn out. Needless to say, I was extremely happy with the results. I bought my air-brush at Harbor Freight, they are very inexpensive. As I did more pieces, I decided that I needed a BETTER air-brush. You know what?????
I like my cheap one just as well or better than the expensive one.

I can tell you that the finish may not look like you expected until you apply the clear-coat. That's when the colors really come alive. With the air-brush you can feather colors, blend colors and apply as light or dark as you want. I am NOT an artist, but felt like one when I finished the rooster. I also cut a mallard duck that some one posted that I used copper FX, torch FX and then used the teal and white dye to accent the head. Looks great. The entire piece doesn't have to be dyed to have a great looking piece.

I find that I have my best results when applying my dyes over the copper patina. You actually use less dye and you don't have to worry about covering each and every spot if you don't want to. Colors blend really well over the copper.

If you haven't already discovered...wear gloves. I bought mine at Harbor Freight by the box but was so excited to get started I didn't put them on. The colors don't look nearly as good under my finger nails as on metal!

Bill is has always been there to answer my questions about the patinas and dyes...Thank You, Bill.

Les, if I you have any more questions about the dyes, send me a message or post a reply and maybe I can help. I know you will get the hang of it and love the results. Customers really are impressed by the vibrant colors. I actually had a friend ask me how to clean copper because he thought my copper patina was really copper!

Robbie

[retiredcpo]

Robbie
I saw that rooster it looked really good.
Had my sons graduation party today talked it over with my brother and he is going to try the airbrush
He Is really good.
Have not had any problem getting the dyes on my hands but the last time I tried the red I did get some on the table.
Never thought about using copper as a base interesting idea. I am going to play around with the patinas(I allready bought a starter kit) but I need to get this project done first I have learned not to start to many at once cause they never get done.
Im going to cut a new part and give him the dyes and let him at it.
Les

[hobbyrobbie]

OK, I think you will be impressed with the results!

[oldsoulmetal]

I use two different types of dye. The solvent dye steel fx sells. and a product from sculpt nouveau. called smart stain. with their smart coat 2k to thin and overcoat. of the 2 steel fx's solvent dye is the easiest to use and clean up with. The smart stains i layer colors on to get desired results drying with a hair dryer as i go. laying down very thin layers.
using solvent dyes be-careful I did find if you dont lock down the dye and apply a 2 part top coat it ran and bleed the dyes into all kinds of wierdness. to solve this i top coated with a quick drying laquer then applied my two part. I am still very novice at this form of finishing. I have used brushes and foam applicators with horrible results and swore id given up on the coloring. Then i bought a pasche talon air brush. Now I get incredible results and love the process. alot less head aches and stress.

One last note: Bill at steel fx's will be your best source... not just for product, but the wealth of info he has. I have called him several times and came away from each conversation with more understandable info then Spending a whole day looking on the internet for answers.

[steelfx]

"One last note: Bill at steel fx's will be your best source... not just for product, but the wealth of info he has. I have called him several times and came away from each conversation with more understandable info then Spending a whole day looking on the internet for answers. "

You're very kind. Thank you!

Bill

[lethalfab6]

Very thankful for this thread right now! I am going to purchase some Steel F/X solvent dyes today and this answered quite a few questions.

Does anyone know how many square inches one 4oz bottle of the dye will cover. I know it depends on thickness and number of coats. I'm looking at about 2 to maybe 3 coats using an airbrush.

Also, I have seen some products using these dyes where the color looks very solid and not as translucent. What is the best way to achieve that look? Leave a little bit of mill scale one, add white, add black, don't thin it? If I have to buy an extra color to achieve a deeper flatter red I need to order some of that too.

Any advice greatly appreciated.

And Bill has DEF been helpful in the past! Thanks all!

[steelfx]

Also, I have seen some products using these dyes where the color looks very solid and not as translucent. What is the best way to achieve that look? Leave a little bit of mill scale one, add white, add black, don't thin it? If I have to buy an extra color to achieve a deeper flatter red I need to order some of that too.


To achieve a deeper, flatter red, I would shade (darken) it with a few drops of the Black Solvent Dye.
If you want to make it opaque, you could mix Black & White to a light grey, & use that basically as a primer on your steel prior to spraying the red.

Hope that makes sense.

thanks!

Bill

[lethalfab6]

Ok, so I would do a layer of the FX Black, dry item and then spray with the red steel dye? Then clearcoat it.

Also how much coverage can I get from one 4 oz bottle on average?

Thanks!

[oldsoulmetal]

Just thought I'd re-post to this thread a little trick I found. I use Steel Fx (SF) solvent dyes exclusively when coloring any of our projects. We where using them straight from the bottle But I found I was using Alot of dye, and I also found that the colors would blend together some times when we did our clear coat. So now we use Sculpt noveaus clear guard flat (Permalac) as a base
adding dye to it. Then we spray the mixture on. This works wonderfully as it allows you to layer colors and mix colors. And it solves the issue of the clear coat dissolving the Dye. The flat base seems to show better in our lighting and when you clear coat over with a satin or gloss the colors really come out.

under stand that you will have to take and clean your air brush with xylene or similar product... and once in a while do a complete breakdown and clean it with naked gun or similar gun cleaner. It also means spraying in a well ventilated area.
hope this helps someone
David

[mcbarnes]

mcbarnes

[lockedandstocked]

how did you get that rose to work? i cant get it to connect its like 5000 paths.