What size of sheet metal do you keep on hand

[pony]

I'm finally ready to start some experimenting with my newly built table. Of course I now have to part with some money to get some material to work with.
I plan a trip to the metal supplier on Saturday, but there is such a dazzling array of gauges.
Can someone give an idiots guide to a good base sample of steel to buy, and whether to get cold rolled or hot rolled.
I'm looking to get 8*4 foot sheets.

Here are my concerns:
I don't want to buy something that is 'specialist' and therefore more expensive.
I don't want to have the poor clerk look up every price they have, this place is usually busy.
I don't want material so thin that it easily warps when being cut.

I'm just testing the machine at the moment. I'll be making a house number plaque for a neighbor to hang on her gate, and a "Welcome" sign that will be 4 feet by 2 feet and welded between two 3 1/2 inch pipes on a H post on my drive.

My plasma cutter is a Thermal Dynamics Cutmaster A60 (3/8" production cutting). My table is just 4 feet by 2 feet cut area.

Maybe some of you could list the type of things you make and the gauge of steel you make them from.

I know, I take the prize for lame post of the week

[Scratch]

Not a lame post at all.... everybody started once and there's lots of questions.

I have a 4X8 table so things will be a little harder for you because most sheet steel doesn't come in 4X2 sheets so you'll need to have them cut it for you, and they usually charge a cut fee. On the plus side.... you won't have to figure out how to manhandle a 465 pound sheet of 4X8 1/4" thick steel by yourself like I have to do...

With that being said, as far as CR or HR goes, I'd personally try to use HR since it'll rust slower. CR is a little bit stronger if you're making brackets, tabs, etc.... but for signs HR is fine. If you plan on using patina though, you may not want that "mill scale" coating that is on HR steel because certain patinas don't react well with the mill scale. I personally like removing "some" of the mill scale when I use certain patinas so that variation in color shows up very well. If you're painting them, it doesn't matter though either one. I think CR is a tad more expensive but not much.

As for thickness, I use a ton of 14 gauge and 11 gauge for signwork and wall hangings. I use alot of 3/16" and 1/4" for tabs, brackets etc... I alos use some 16 gauge on occasion.

I try to keep 6 sheets of each thickness in my rack. When I get down to 2 full sheets left, I go buy 4 more.
I have in my rack:

20 G, 18 G, 16 G, 14 G, 11 G (1/8"), 7 G (3/16"), 1/4"

All in either HR or CR, I really don't care since I use them both.

I don't keep any Stainless steel or Aluminum on hand since I rarely cut it. If I need them for a project, I'll go buy them then, I don't like them sitting around my shop.... I wouldn't want them to rust....

[pony]

Perfect. This is the type of info I wanted.

I'm lucky in that whilst my table only cuts 2*4, the gantry allows me to slide a 4 foot wide sheet under it and out the other side. I can take a 4x8 sheet and slide the first 2 feet in to the cutting area, then slide another two feet in and so on. In theory, using the laser crosshair, I could cut a 4 feet wide piece at any length by sliding it through in 2 foot sections and using the crosshair to line it up every time I move the material. New pierce points on each 2 feet section would seriously limit what I could cut though, as would my ability to line up each section.

[Scratch]

Sweet.... so you WILL be lucky enough to have to manhandle all them big, awkward, heavy sheets of heavy heavy steel... lucky you!

[pony]

I have a oxy/acetylene setup I bought that I still haven't mastered, if I don't blow myself up I may be able to cut them to a more manageable size. I can get them off the trailer with the tractor, but the tractor will not fit through the workshop door. I know what Mrs Pony will say if I ask for help, and it would not be repeatable


Do the following USD prices for hot rolled plate in 48" by 96" seem reasonable? I imagine it varies a lot by region given the weight to truck these things from the mill. I'm in DFW, TX
16ga - $46.95
14 ga - $56.875
11ga - $89
3/16 $139.412
1/4 - $181.25

[AnotherDano]

I have a oxy/acetylene setup I bought that I still haven't mastered, if I don't blow myself up I may be able to cut them to a more manageable size.

Remember; "A" before "O" or up you go.

I can get them off the trailer with the tractor, but the tractor will not fit through the workshop door. I know what Mrs Pony will say if I ask for help, and it would not be repeatable


Do the following USD prices for hot rolled plate in 48" by 96" seem reasonable? I imagine it varies a lot by region given the weight to truck these things from the mill. I'm in DFW, TX
16ga - $46.95
14 ga - $56.875
11ga - $89
3/16 $139.412
1/4 - $181.25

I use 14Ga cold rolled for 99% of what I do. Mostly signs and shiny things. I use no paint, just powder coating. Mill scale is a problem that I don't have time to fool with.

My supplier sells it for about $130 for a 4x10' and I have him cut it into 4x5 sheets. My table is a 4x4 and, like you, I just let a foot hang over the end and slide in onto the work area as needed. And a 4x5 fits nicely in my SUV beater.

[minnfatz]

You might also want to check and see if your steel supplier will sell you their drops. Most of the steel I buy are drops and I get them for scrap prices, which is still overpriced at 55 cents/lb. Most of the drops I buy are 4'x4' and smaller, which makes them more managable.

[pony]

Sweet.... so you WILL be lucky enough to have to manhandle all them big, awkward, heavy sheets of heavy heavy steel... lucky you!

You sir, are a very wise person. I had them cut the sheets in half to 4x4s at an expense of $5 per sheet. 1/4 inch and 3/16 inch were both available in 4x4 sizes, I had to have them cut the 14 gauge and 11 gauge. At $5 a sheet it seemed extravagant at the time. I just got through unloading them, 4x4 is more than enough size to try and manhandle. The 1/4 inch ate my lunch and whooped me good

[steelfx]

"With that being said, as far as CR or HR goes, I'd personally try to use HR since it'll rust slower. CR is a little bit stronger if you're making brackets, tabs, etc.... but for signs HR is fine. If you plan on using patina though, you may not want that "mill scale" coating that is on HR steel because certain patinas don't react well with the mill scale. I personally like removing "some" of the mill scale when I use certain patinas so that variation in color shows up very well."

Just a thought: Removing Mill-Scale from HR is very fast & easy. And it's a lot less expensive than CR. Where I'm at, the alloy for CR, P&O and HR is exactly the same, so I'm interested in knowing what you mean about CR being stronger?

Edumacate me!

thanks,

Bill
Steel FX

[Scratch]

Just a thought: Removing Mill-Scale from HR is very fast & easy. And it's a lot less expensive than CR. Where I'm at, the alloy for CR, P&O and HR is exactly the same, so I'm interested in knowing what you mean about CR being stronger?

Edumacate me!

thanks,

Bill
Steel FX

Hot rolled steel is just that... rolled into shape while hot. That heat makes the grain of the steel nice and relaxed.
Cold rolled steel is formed into shape and size while cold, which gives it a tighter grain. If you were to heat the CR steel, basically annealing it, the grain would relax and it wouldn't really matter anymore, but if the temp hasn't changed, it will be harder steel than HR.

Next time you get a chance, try twisting some square solid stock, in CR and HR. Something like 3/8" or so. I make these sunflower things which uses 3 feet of 3/8" solid square tubing for the stem. I put the stock into a vice and using my twisting tool, I turn them 8 times using HR, no heat, all by hand. I have goofed up and cut some CR stock by mistake. I can barely get 1 or 2 twists out of them. It's crazy weird the difference in the two!

[steelfx]

Holy Krap! i did not know that! That's what I like about this forum...i learn something new every day!
I don't do any bending, rolling or forming so I wouldn't have realized that. As far as grinding and/or polishing I haven't noticed any difference between the 3 forms of A36.

I have worked with AR-500 (3/8") and there is a definite difference between those two. I made reactive gun targets for a while for shooting enthusiasts & gun clubs, but there was so much material cost, weld-up of parts & attaching springs that I gave it up.

Thanks for the knowledge!

[muzza]

Here is a link to a 3.16 MB download which I think you'll find invaluable. http://www.lysaght.com/files/dmfile/Lys ... nApr09.pdf

Ever since I can remember any metal trades person here in Australia has referred to this document, "The Lysagt Referee" as the bible. It has so much information and it's free, yes I realize much of the coding and terminologies may be slightly different to other countries but the information it contains is fairly universal.
For example, if you go to page 34 you can gain an understanding of the manufacturing process, pages 41 to 64 will tell you all you ever wondered about Cold Rolled, Hot Rolled, etc.
My original hard copy is the 21st Edition and this was getting pretty shabby but back in the late 80's we had a representative from BHP Steel (The Big Australian) come to our shop with our steel merchant as a courtesy call, when he asked if their was anything he could help with, i replied "yea, how about organizing a few of these (held up my copy) for the boys, as they were constantly grabbing mine" he laughed at the state of mine, in the next couple of days we received a parcel with 10 copies of the 28th Edition, one of which is on my desk as I type ( and when I got this link I downloaded the 32nd Edition).

Hope you find it helpful.

Murray

[muzza]

Sorry forgot to also mention that as it's an Aussie publication it"s in metric but there is a conversion chart on page 369 & 370, also some handy formulae from page 364 (area's, volumes, etc.).

[steelfx]

Very cool...thanks! (Downloading now)

[Machiavelli]

if you try to keep your work to 16 ga. or thinner, you'll keep tool prices at bay. a box and pan break or a press break, corner shears, louvre punches et al. are much cheaper for materials 16ga or less. soon as you look for equipment that can handle thicker materials, the price skyrockets.

[WSS]

Just in case this is helpful. I use it quite a bit. All I need to know is the price per pound. Not so good for gauge, I suppose some math would fix it.
A36) $.63 per lb today
AR400) $1.43 per lb today
AR500) $1.50 per lb today

#1 scrap $370 per gross ton!!!!

Southern California

WSS