Shaper Trace for digitizing

[adbuch]

This looks interesting! I have ordered one from Amazon to check it out.
David


https://www.shapertools.com/en-us/trace

[adbuch]

https://rasterweb.net/raster/2024/01/15 ... per-trace/

[abmetal]

Interesting. I'm anxious to see what you think of it. Might be something Wifey and I needed years ago.

Allen

[tinspark]

Yes David, That looks very cool. Please post results. The price is right too!
Also, I would be curious if you can hold that Tracer frame up to your computer monitor and digitize what’s on the monitor. That would be useful at times. I just watched a video on it and it kind of explains everything here.

[adbuch]

I could see this being very handy - particularly if larger frames were available in different sizes.
David

[Joe Jones]

I ordered one as well, with the perpetual license. I hate renewing things on an annual basis.

This looks interesting. It is basically a device that does what Photoshop does with the CURVES tool. However, I can see good uses for it.

Joe

[tinspark]

I could see this being very handy - particularly if larger frames were available in different sizes.
David

I was thinking the same thing David. If they made a bigger frame, it might compete with the digitizer board that the
Proprietor has featured on this site several times. If I remember right, you might own one of those and you would be the perfect person to unbiasedly share the differences . etc, pros and cons. It seems like it would be easy for the frame to be made larger and maybe even snap together which would be cool so that it could fit into a smaller Container and be cheaper to ship which Amazon likes smaller boxes.but I don’t know how the guts look inside of it maybe like an old school slot car track which a lot of us used to play too when we were youngins’ . Especially if all of the sensors need to be connected together in a closed loop for some reason

[adbuch]

I could see this being very handy - particularly if larger frames were available in different sizes.
David

I was thinking the same thing David. If they made a bigger frame, it might compete with the digitizer board that the
Proprietor has featured on this site several times. If I remember right, you might own one of those and you would be the perfect person to unbiasedly share the differences . etc, pros and cons. It seems like it would be easy for the frame to be made larger and maybe even snap together which would be cool so that it could fit into a smaller Container and be cheaper to ship which Amazon likes smaller boxes.but I don’t know how the guts look inside of it maybe like an old school slot car track which a lot of us used to play too when we were youngins’ . Especially if all of the sensors need to be connected together in a closed loop for some reason

There are no sensors or wires - simply an optical pattern. The dot pattern is used to correct for parallax and for scaling. So once you take your picture, their software effectively does an auto trace (much like Inkscape) and scales to size/correct parallax. So what you end up with is an svg file that can be further edited using their $300 software, Inkscape, Design Edge, etc.

The guy in the article I referenced above (and here is the link again) took a screen shot of the trace frame from their website and printed it out and it works fine. You still need to purchase their original frame so you can scan in the QR code. After that, you can use any frame you want.

https://rasterweb.net/raster/2024/01/15 ... per-trace/

You don't need to purchase their $300 software package to use the Tracer. It comes with a perpetual license. That additional program is simply for editing - I would normally do this on my PC, but alternatives like Affinity Designer ($18) are probably a good option if you want to do all of the editing on your phone or iPad.

David

[Joe Jones]

It was clever of them to require the unique QR CODE to use the app. The frame's dot pattern is easy enough to reproduce without PAYING for the frame.

I am curious though. Is the PLANE of the frame the focal point for the scans, or could the frame be mounted vertically to a tripod for example, and then use the app to trace an old barn, or a sports car that is viewed THROUGH the suspended frame?

THAT would make this an awesome device!

Joe

[adbuch]

Shaper Studio - very basic program for beginners. Not worth the price as it applies to the Shaper Trace - in my opinion. I think it is more intended for use with their Shaper Origin hand held router, which sells for around $3k.

David

[adbuch]

I received my Shaper Trace today and initial testing looks promising. It does seem to do a very good job of autotracing a drawing and converting it to svg.
So I take the picture using their frame, upload the svg to their server, then download to my pc and open with Inkscape for editing. Here are a few examples from pictures I took using their trace frame.

The first one was a manual trace I did on a piece of white paper using their supplied fine-tip marker.

The second one was from a photo of a printout I already had from a recent project. The snowmen were already printed on white paper, so I placed the trace frame over the snowmen and took the picture.

David

[adbuch]

You have to scan the QR code at the beginning of each session. I think after that you could use any frame you want - larger or smaller.

Then you take your picture. It tells you when the entire frame is in view, but it wants to take the pictures in portrait mode and doesn't like landscape - which is what I always prefer.

Here it the template I traced with their supplied fine tip marker.

This is an example of picture I took for the tracer software to work. The entire frame need to be in the picture, or it gives you an error message.

This is the snowmen that I already had printed. I placed it behind the frame and took a picture from the side. They like you to be off at an angle and it complains if you are looking too much straight on to the frame.

So you want to be off at an angle like this when you take the actual photo.

[adbuch]

Here it the manual trace result of the French Curve before and after edit. Back the day, French Curves were one of the many tools used for manual drafting (drawing board, T-square, etc.) before the advent of the pc.

By contrast, I tried using a Wacom drawing tablet to manually trace this same French Curve into Inkscape with a very poor result. It produced very jagged lines, not smooth like the ones from the Shaper Trace.

David

[adbuch]

The Shaper Trace centerline trace result will have many small segments that will need to be edited out. But the result I achieved here is still much better than using Inkscape for centerline autotraces as I have done in the past. So far I am liking this new tool, and I think it is a pretty good deal for $99. It would be great if they offered these trace frames in different sizes along with a scaling option for each size frame - so whichever size frame you use it would automatically scale the resulting file to the correct size.

As it is now, I think it would be fairly easy to make some larger frames and then just scale manually in Inkscape or whatever software you are using to edit the svg files. The larger frame dimensions should be some exact multiple of the existing frame to make it easy to scale. So larger frames x2, x3, etc. A smaller frame might be useful as well. Perhaps I should contact the manufacturer and suggest this to them, although I expect they have already had similar requests.

David

[adbuch]

I tried taking a photo of the actual Shaper Trace frame and printed it out on 8.5 x 11 white paper. Then used it instead of the actual Shaper Trace frame and it seems to work fine. Since the printed frame is smaller than the actual frame, the resulting svg trace will be larger by the ratio of the large frame to the smaller printed frame. Scaling will be required in Inkscape to get the correct size.


This is a photocopy of the trace frame printed on 8.5 x 11 white paper.

Here is the result from the Shaper Trace software. Imported to Inkscape for comparison with the result from the actual frame.

I also tried taking photos looking thru the frame. Here are some of the results.

[tinspark]

Very interesting David!
How does it compare to your digitizer?
Sounds like it is all in Shaper Tracers software??

[adbuch]

Very interesting David!
How does it compare to your digitizer?
Sounds like it is all in Shaper Tracers software??

Doug - these are two entirely different tools. The Calcomp board is something that you use to trace over a drawing, template, or solid object and it converts your trace to dxf format using the Logictrace program. Logictrace also has tools for creating circles, arcs, straight lines (point to point) - you do this right on the drawing board. So the pen acts sort of like a smart mouse - similar to the pen on the Wacom tablets. There is no camera involved. For hand tracing (free hand) like Stan Kern does, you would need to have a very steady hand.

The Shaper Trace basically uses the frame to scale/align the photo you take with your phone and uses their proprietary software to do an autotrace - much like Inkscape or CorelDraw.

For something like the French Curve example I showed above, I expect a similar result could be obtained with either method (LogicTrace/Calcomp or Shaper Trace). Using either method, there would still be some post processing/editing to be done to clean up the vector file (Node Editing, etc.).

If there was a large Shaper Trace frame the same size as the Calcomp large board - say 44" x 60" - then I think you could probably achieve a similar result tracing a large object using either method. It would be tracing on the Calcomp vs. tracing on the Shaper Trace and taking a photo. If you have ever used one of the better Wacom tablets, then it would be similar to using the Calcomp - except with the Wacom you need to use the setting in Inkscape to auto-smooth the trace as you draw it - whereas the LogicTrace software performs a similar smoothing as you do your trace and provides a smoothed dxf vector file.

The LogicTrace software runs around $2200 by itself, or you can buy the large 44 x 60 Calcomp board with the LogicTrace software for around $4000 (not sure on the exact price today). I paid around $3500 for mine about 8 years ago. I also have a smaller Calcomp tablet 12 x 18 size that cost around $600 when I bought it. So these are pretty expensive.

By contrast, the Shaper Trace with software is $99 plus tax/shipping. I bought mine on Amazon - so $107.60 total cost. I am not sure what the cost would be to have a print shop print out larger size frames on white paper. But once you had some of these larger paper frames, they could be attached to a piece of hardboard and used over and over. Just lay your large sheet of paper over the inside of the frame and draw/trace and take a picture.

I had also thought about maybe making a large frame using the cnc plasma table and then adding the white dots around the frame with paint or colored inserts into holes. I think I would try the print shop method first.

I hope this gives you some idea of the similarities and differences between the Calcomp/LogicTrace and Shaper Trace.

David

[adbuch]

Doug - it just occurred to me that I could possibly use my sharpie holder on my Plasmacam table to draw the white dots onto a large piece of poster board to create the larger frame. Maybe using a white sharpie pen. I might just do a smaller one first just to see if it works.

David

[tinspark]

Excellent explanation David thank you for the information
very good and thorough assessment . Look forward to seeing what you can do with the shaper tracer.

[adbuch]

I took some measurements of the Trace frame and drew it up with Design Edge using a photo for a guide. I printed out a copy and it seems to work fine. Now I just need to decide what method to use to make the larger frames.

David

[adbuch]

I just came across the video showing a larger 3D printed Shaper Trace frame. He calls it a "Mega frame". He 3D printed it as separate pieces and glued it together. I sent him an email for more information.

David

[tinspark]

I just came across the video showing a larger 3D printed Shaper Trace frame. He calls it a "Mega frame". He 3D printed it as separate pieces and glued it together. I sent him an email for more information.

David

Cool beans David!! Looks super handy! Hopefully they do not tweak their software somehow to only allow the regular size and then ask for the dreaded $998 to upgrade to a different size!! (tongue in cheek comment of course, but sounds familiar to a lot of us here)
I do not know anything about their Shaper Trace software , or if it is even possible to to limit sizes
hee hee!!

[adbuch]

I just came across the video showing a larger 3D printed Shaper Trace frame. He calls it a "Mega frame". He 3D printed it as separate pieces and glued it together. I sent him an email for more information.

David

Cool beans David!! Looks super handy! Hopefully they do not tweak their software somehow to only allow the regular size and then ask for the dreaded $998 to upgrade to a different size!! (tongue in cheek comment of course, but sounds familiar to a lot of us here)
I do not know anything about their Shaper Trace software , or if it is even possible to to limit sizes
hee hee!!

Doug - the guy in the video claims it works for all the different sizes. You just have to scale the svg accordingly. Andrew and myself are both working on making some larger frames, so we will report back with our progress.

David

[plasmanewbie]

Read the whole topic, super interesting David!

[adbuch]

Read the whole topic, super interesting David!

Thanks Plasmanewbie! I am still working on this. I ordered the guy's 3D print files to check them out - cost was $10. The only problem is that they are intended for the Bambu Labs 3D printers, and not the printers I have. He supplied the files in .3mf format - and it is lot's of work to import the mesh files to Fusion360, convert to solid bodies, and then have to recreate the sketches for each part. I did that for one of the smaller frames, but decided to go ahead and purchase his $99.95 bundle that includes 4 different size frames already printed.

The Mega frame is 200% larger. There is also a 75% size and two 50% sizes. I think the printing for this sort of stuff is much easier using the Bambu Labs printers, as they have a feature that "paints" the color onto the top layer for the dots. So much easier than creating two separate stl files - one for frame ant one for dots - and then importing both of them into the same slicer program for printing.

I am also thinking about cnc plasma cutting a large frame - 300% size - maybe from 14 ga. or 11 ga. steel and then either drawing on the dots with the sharpie pen holder (after painting the frame black) and then satin clear over the whole frame to protect the dots.

Or I might cnc plasma cut from 11 ga. and then machine (or 3D print) some small round plugs to install into the holes for the dots. There are 4 different sizes of the dots, and a total of around 73 dots per frame.

Lot of fun to be had!

David