Newbie with a Non Brand plasma machine / CAD package selection

[Steambike]

Hi Guys,
This is my first post here, and I guess like everyone else I am looking for help and advice please:)
I have built my own plasma table over the last year, it is a 5 X 10' with air extraction and 2 water troughs below to catch the particulates (Thanks largely to the info gleaned from Jim Colt with the design, works great!) THC150 and homemade "touchdown sensor" for starting each cut, homemade air drying setup and so on, I am running sheetcam and Mach3 which all work great......however, due to an economic downturn I have had to go with one of the import plasma machines instead of the coveted Hypertherm, at least for now.
The unit does actually cut pretty good and running it at 220V makes it work much better, and here is where I am falling apart (lack of experience on my part and lack of anyone local who's brains I can pick, as well as all the info I have found on line being for higher end plasma machines, my machine came with zero info and a very poor operator manual) , I have setup at various amperages (mine goes to 60Amps on the dial) and tried different speeds getting fair results, (currently running 30A and only 55IPM on 16g mild steel plate) but as soon as I start cutting intricate designs I get warping and missed starts, in all honesty I am sure that the issue is with the way I set it up and NOT with the Plasma machine itself ("it's a poor workman who blames his tools, right!", one of my Dad's sayings), looking at some of the other posts I strongly suspect that my speed should be 3-4 times faster than it is.......)
So, bottom line is this:
1) does anyone have any advice or tips for a complete novice who has all the stuff in place, but little experience, with regards to how to begin setting up the table and torch and getting the best results (or at least acceptable results)? Anyone else out there running a lower end machine willing to offer advice?
2) Any advice on selection of a CAD package to work with Sheetcam and Mach3 would also be appreciated.
Thanks in advance guys, I look forward to being able to pay it back in the future!
Steambike

[acourtjester]

Welcome aboard, many here have started like you so there are many to help. You can use the search function near the top right for topics you want to read about. There are things that will help you dial in your setup, thing to start with are speed and thickness. With warping and dross you can find how speed effects this, to slow and lots of dross and warping. But the amps you are using will also effect the warping. You should download a copy of the hypertherm manual for say a pm 65 and look at the cutting charts in that manual. Many plasma unit will cut well at a cut height of 0.060" so use that as a ball park distance. Pick a metal thickness and stay with it until you are cutting it well maybe 16 Ga. do some test cuts on a straight line for about 8" to dial in the cut voltage on you THC start about 130. Stop the cutting action at maybe 6" and check the cutter height and adjust your voltage to get the 0.060". You are most likely stuck with one tip (nozzle) size run about 40 amps to start maybe 220 IPM. Look at the dross and move up until you have very little. Note your spects for each thickness as you run tests to build your own charts. If you find them running close to hypertherm you can that may help to guide you with other thicknesses.
I'm sure others will offer more to help.

[acourtjester]

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[Steambike]

Thanks for the quick response acourtjester, and for all the tips, I am off to play with it now........... watch this space:)

[jimcolt]

As acourtjester mentioned.....see if you can buy different nozzles (tips) for your torch. A nozzle with a smaller orifice...or amperage rating is the one to use on thinner materials.....this allows less heat input to the material. For cut charts....use the "non-shielded" cut charts in the Hypertherm manual....as the shield technology in Hypertherm torches will make the specs for those parts quite different from other torches. Usually with other torch designs a higher cut height (than Hypertherm uses) will work better. I would start with about a .100" cut height....and do test cuts increasing the cut speeds until the dross is minimized......at the dross free speed you will also have less warpage. On 16 ga steel, 30 amps (with a 30 amp nozzle design) you will be around 175 to 225 ipm when the dross goes away. Anything under 10 gauge should be cut at less than 40 amps with a 30 or 40 amp rated nozzle for best results. Good luck! We will wait patiently for you to buy a Hypertherm! I understand the need for budget considerations! Jim Colt Hypertherm

[Steambike]

Well I spent most of the day Saturday trying different settings as per acourtjester's recommendations, and I'll come back to the conclusions later, but first; the torch I have is a "Panasonic P80"(clone) which from my research seems to be a generic type unit with no interchangeable tips.......unless you guys know differently? The most information I can find is that it is rated for !00Amps, I am running a hand held torch not a machine torch at this time, but it is mounted and wired as per a machine torch in case that is relevant? I am piercing at a set height of 0.0001-4" (yes really that many 0s!)

Back to the testing, I made a "spreadsheet" which covered the following;
Cut speed / Amps / THC volts / Pierce height / Cut height (set before travelling) / Final cut height (where THC set it) / THC speed /comments
I was cutting 16guage mild steel with an air pressure of 60PSI as per the manufacturers recommendations.

I won't even start to bore you guys with the pages of tests I did, I tried everything from 40-45 Amps, 70-130 Volts as the THC setting, and 180-220 cut speeds trying to achieve the 0.60" final cut height, and when I did end with that the cut ended up only being about 70% of the length of my cut distance. I also played with the THC travel speed and removed the time delay after pierce as the time it took to move to cut height appeared to be long enough for everything to work fine (my pierce is still a little ugly, but the cut and stop were quite nice).

I found that running at 45Amps (from the Powermax 45 operators manual) and a travel speed of 200IPM and with my THC at 76Volts and ended with a final cut height of between 0.015" and 0.035" the pierce was ok and the cut and end was quite nice with a kerf of around 50Thou, however the cut height was WAY too low from what I can tell from the input from you guys.

This would also explain why when I actually set everything up to cut something other than a straight line the head snagged and took the torch off it's home-made safety magnetic holder......... (cheaper than a torch setup, even a P80 clone, with the number of crashes I made pre THC, ).

So back to the drawing board as soon as I get the chance (hopefully this week a couple of evenings), I will go to the 0.100 cut height as per Jim (thanks again!) and try the 30Amps and 175-225ipm and we will see where that takes us, any other recommendations before I get out there will be gratefully received, otherwise I will post more results as I go.

Many thanks again acourtjester and Jim

Steambike

[Steambike]

I was trying for a cut of 0.060" not 0.60" just my typo!

[acourtjester]

When I first started I used a Panasonic P80 torch and there are different tips (nozzles) for it but the lowest is for 60 amps.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJfW0r8p ... e=youtu.be
you can go to eBay and find different tips from 1.1 to 1.5 some seller start 1.1 is for 60 amps. If you have an OA torch tip cleaning tool you could check you tips to see what size they are 1.1 mm equals about 0.043". I would push the air up to about 80 PSI. If memory serves me right I was cutting at 0.06" so you may need to up the voltage too, I think I was using 100 volts on the Proma THC.
Hang in there.

[Steambike]

I'll check the size tonight, guess it would be too much to hope that they could have identification on them:)
So as my machine came with that torch and consumables I sort of hoped (read assumed) that they would be appropriate for my machine.............i rechecked and my machine is actually rated 10-50 amps.
How much difference does the nozzle make? Am I just wasting my time this route or with perseverence can i get this to work?? (Maybe get a different torch??)
Thanks again!

[acourtjester]

Nozzle is relative to power, thickness of metal, kerf width, and speed.
example the Hypertherm manual for the PM 65 shows mild steel fine cut nozzle 40 amps for 26 to 20 Ga and 45 amps for 18 to 10 Ga. and cutting at lower speed you can use 30 amps for 26 to 20 Ga. The 45 amp nozzle goes from 26 Ga to 1/4" from 350 IPM to 48 IPM
I think some of the nozzles for the Panasonic had numbers stamped on them like 1.1 or 1.3. I have all 3 sizes spairs if you want them and will pay the postage I can send them to you.

[Steambike]

That would be great, thanks! I'll pm you later.
Is it just the tip as per your photos and I use the same "electrode" piece or are they different too?

[urbnsr]

Yep - Same electrode. I also have some of these nozzles available... Somewhere.

[Steambike]

Perfect, thanks! Acourtjester has put the ones he had in the post for me, so hopefully by the weekend I will be ready to start testing again, going to try 80psi, 100V on the thc and 0.06" as my initisl height after piercing. Speed in the 200ipm range to start.........then go from there:)
I was pondering over the weekend about the new Hypertherm 45xp, once funds permit I will get one, (they should be in Canada by then) but I was wondering how much difference there will be in cut quality from my setup now (once working right.....) or if the real difference is the setup for different plate thicknesses and materials and much much better customer support? (Thanks largely to Mr Jim Colt)

[jimcolt]

The difference in cut quality between the Powermax45 XP and the system you are using now:
- No experimenting. Set the specs according to the cut charts in the operators manual.....good cuts will occur!
- Easy to find the different consumables. There are over 3000 stores that sell them in the US and Canada, some online.
- Even though the Chinese made copies of consumables for your Panasonic clone torch are cheap to buy......they cost more to use (they will not last long) in comparison to the Powermax45 XP torch and consumables. Longer life equals lower operating cost.
- Finecut consumables for best cuts below 10 gauge (3mm, 1/8"), 45 amps shielded for 26 gauge through 1/2" (production and piercing). Marking parts for marking without cutting through...great for layout lines, etc.
- Auto air control....auto adjusts air pressure to settings that provide the best cut quality depending on power levels and process selection being used.

I understand the need for buying on a budget....but when you factor in everything (time experimenting, materials used, higher operating cost, etc., is there really much difference in the cost of ownership between the low cost imports and a Powermax?

Jim

Perfect, thanks! Acourtjester has put the ones he had in the post for me, so hopefully by the weekend I will be ready to start testing again, going to try 80psi, 100V on the thc and 0.06" as my initisl height after piercing. Speed in the 200ipm range to start.........then go from there:)
I was pondering over the weekend about the new Hypertherm 45xp, once funds permit I will get one, (they should be in Canada by then) but I was wondering how much difference there will be in cut quality from my setup now (once working right.....) or if the real difference is the setup for different plate thicknesses and materials and much much better customer support? (Thanks largely to Mr Jim Colt)

[Steambike]

Thanks Jim, i appreciate the response, i wasn't trying to "bait" you, (sorry if it came across that way). You are absolutely right too, the time i have wasted trying to get my machine up and running, coupled with consumables and materials wasted equals easily the cost of the superior machine, my advice to anyone starting out would be to go with the best you can afford.
Unfortunately I am where I am for the time being and have no choice but to plough forward on this track for a while longer.........is the 45XP available in Canada yet?
Thanks
Dave

[jimcolt]

We started shipping to Canada on September 26th. There should be close to 1000 or so there!

Jim Colt